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For more, I'm joined by constitutional attorney and former Justice Department official David Rifkin. Good to see you, David. Thanks for being here. So a local prosecutor, wasn't even a state prosecutor, a local prosecutor using racketeering charges against a former president, 18 others. The Wall Street Journal, by the way, editorialized this week, inflating it into a RICO conspiracy makes the case less credible, not more. Now, I know you agree with that. Explain why. It is a very broad-ranging charge. It's a charge that incorporates as predicate offenses, lots of exercises or First Amendment rights, including things like tweets. It's never been used in that way. Obviously, RICO is typically used in the context of real basic criminal conduct. But it's not just the substantive charges. I think that this is a very weak case that's going to die very quickly, at least as far as being prosecuted in Georgia courts. You do have attorneys for Mark Meadows, who is Trump's former chief of staff, who filed a motion a couple of days ago to have a case transferred to Federal District Court, which they entitled because of a statutory immunity for federal offices, which is the case, obviously, Mr. Meadows, as well as Mr. Clark, who was a DOJ attorney. So this case does not have, and it's not just, David, a transfer venue to a federal court. It is also an immunity to which they're both entitled. And as I've argued in an article for you a little while ago, President Trump has a constitutionally based immunity based upon the Supreme Court case, as called Nixon v. Fitzgerald, to give some absolute immunity for all the actions done within the outer perimeter of his constitutional duties, even if those actions were unlawful. So the Fulton County case is not going to hold. Yeah, I was just going to say, other than that, you think it's fine. But also, there's a guy named Rudy Giuliani, who's one of the co-defendants, a guy who became famous as a prosecutor using RICO. He knows RICO better than probably anybody in the United States right now. He knows, not only knows how to use it against somebody, but he's probably seen every defense against it imaginable. Who do you think is going to win that if it ever goes to court against him? The prosecutor, the local prosecutor, or Rudy Giuliani? I will put my money on Giuliani. But as I said, I do not think that this case would ever be litigated on the merits, given the immunity arguments, which I actually do not apply to defendants from Georgia. But I wanted to emphasize both of the viewers, despite the weakness of those cases, leaving aside all the political implications, polarization, the dual justice system, it's a horrible precedent. As you said in your introduction, we have a local district attorney, not even an AG, bringing cases, and it's particularly the case with Ms. Willis, that goes to the heart, however you feel about what Trump did, and people like Jeff Clark or Mark Meadows, that were essentially discharging the duties of their federal office. This is a horrible precedent for federalism, separation of powers, exercise of first amendment rights, and a variety of other things. These are truly toxic cases, and even though I think all of them, or most of them are going to die, that does not diminish the toxicity, so I find them quite regrettable. David, it's also a pile on, because basically a lot of the charges are the same ones that Jack Smith brought on a federal level, and they both get to the issue, both cases try to get into the mind of Donald Trump, deciding whether or not he knew or didn't know whether he was lying or wasn't lying about what happened in the election. There's so much supposition in these charges, and then the question of isn't a candidate allowed to contest an election? It's like, sorry, you're not allowed to have the free speech to either question it publicly or actually try to defend your case in court. Yes, it definitely criminalizes the rough and tumble of electioneering and battles over elections. It is going to be played out for other people down the road. It is highly regrettable. I cannot tell you how depressing I find it. And then, by the way, the question of what did Trump believe is irrelevant actually for immunity purposes, which is an objective test, and it goes to whether or not he was doing things that will then again were the sphere of his obvious constitutional responsibility. David, very quickly, I want to ask a question. If you could answer as quickly as possible on the Biden investigations that are going on. Special counsel David Weiss, he wasn't special counsel before last week, but he has been making claims about his independence this past week, about how independent he is. I'm just wondering, do you believe that he is completely independent from the Department of Justice? No, I don't for two reasons. First of all, you choose special counsel from outside department. Second, one of the things he should be investigating is what happened in the front end with this aborted plea, and he was the one who was involved in it. So how can it investigate himself? It's appalling. It's cynical and appalling. David Rifkin, good to see you, sir. Thank you very much.

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